I hope, and suspect, history will judge the real criminals of the mess that is the Mid East today, much much harsher then their servile press has. And deservedly so.

Robert Fisk is the Mid-East correspondent of UK newspaper The Independent. He has lived in the region for 30 years and has written a couple of books about the politics of the region. I have read them and must say he provides an insight into the region one never gets when reading news and analysis from other media outlets, most of all the American ones.

Robert Fisk: A dictator created then destroyed by America
Published: 30 December 2006

Saddam to the gallows. It was an easy equation. Who could be more deserving of that last walk to the scaffold - that crack of the neck at the end of a rope - than the Beast of Baghdad, the Hitler of the Tigris, the man who murdered untold hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis while spraying chemical weapons over his enemies? Our masters will tell us in a few hours that it is a "great day" for Iraqis and will hope that the Muslim world will forget that his death sentence was signed - by the Iraqi "government", but on behalf of the Americans - on the very eve of the Eid al-Adha, the Feast of the Sacrifice, the moment of greatest forgiveness in the Arab world.

But history will record that the Arabs and other Muslims and, indeed, many millions in the West, will ask another question this weekend, a question that will not be posed in other Western newspapers because it is not the narrative laid down for us by our presidents and prime ministers - what about the other guilty men?

No, Tony Blair is not Saddam. We don't gas our enemies. George W Bush is not Saddam. He didn't invade Iran or Kuwait. He only invaded Iraq. But hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians are dead - and thousands of Western troops are dead - because Messrs Bush and Blair and the Spanish Prime Minister and the Italian Prime Minister and the Australian Prime Minister went to war in 2003 on a potage of lies and mendacity and, given the weapons we used, with great brutality.

In the aftermath of the international crimes against humanity of 2001 we have tortured, we have murdered, we have brutalised and killed the innocent - we have even added our shame at Abu Ghraib to Saddam's shame at Abu Ghraib - and yet we are supposed to forget these terrible crimes as we applaud the swinging corpse of the dictator we created.

Who encouraged Saddam to invade Iran in 1980, which was the greatest war crime he has committed for it led to the deaths of a million and a half souls? And who sold him the components for the chemical weapons with which he drenched Iran and the Kurds? We did. No wonder the Americans, who controlled Saddam's weird trial, forbad any mention of this, his most obscene atrocity, in the charges against him. Could he not have been handed over to the Iranians for sentencing for this massive war crime? Of course not. Because that would also expose our culpability.

And the mass killings we perpetrated in 2003 with our depleted uranium shells and our "bunker buster" bombs and our phosphorous, the murderous post-invasion sieges of Fallujah and Najaf, the hell-disaster of anarchy we unleashed on the Iraqi population in the aftermath of our "victory" - our "mission accomplished" - who will be found guilty of this? Such expiation as we might expect will come, no doubt, in the self-serving memoirs of Blair and Bush, written in comfortable and wealthy retirement.

Hours before Saddam's death sentence, his family - his first wife, Sajida, and Saddam's daughter and their other relatives - had given up hope.

"Whatever could be done has been done - we can only wait for time to take its course," one of them said last night. But Saddam knew, and had already announced his own "martyrdom": he was still the president of Iraq and he would die for Iraq. All condemned men face a decision: to die with a last, grovelling plea for mercy or to die with whatever dignity they can wrap around themselves in their last hours on earth. His last trial appearance - that wan smile that spread over the mass-murderer's face - showed us which path Saddam intended to walk to the noose.

I have catalogued his monstrous crimes over the years. I have talked to the Kurdish survivors of Halabja and the Shia who rose up against the dictator at our request in 1991 and who were betrayed by us - and whose comrades, in their tens of thousands, along with their wives, were hanged like thrushes by Saddam's executioners.

I have walked round the execution chamber of Abu Ghraib - only months, it later transpired, after we had been using the same prison for a few tortures and killings of our own - and I have watched Iraqis pull thousands of their dead relatives from the mass graves of Hilla. One of them has a newly-inserted artificial hip and a medical identification number on his arm. He had been taken directly from hospital to his place of execution. Like Donald Rumsfeld, I have even shaken the dictator's soft, damp hand. Yet the old war criminal finished his days in power writing romantic novels.

It was my colleague, Tom Friedman - now a messianic columnist for The New York Times - who perfectly caught Saddam's character just before the 2003 invasion: Saddam was, he wrote, "part Don Corleone, part Donald Duck". And, in this unique definition, Friedman caught the horror of all dictators; their sadistic attraction and the grotesque, unbelievable nature of their barbarity.

But that is not how the Arab world will see him. At first, those who suffered from Saddam's cruelty will welcome his execution. Hundreds wanted to pull the hangman's lever. So will many other Kurds and Shia outside Iraq welcome his end. But they - and millions of other Muslims - will remember how he was informed of his death sentence at the dawn of the Eid al-Adha feast, which recalls the would-be sacrifice by Abraham, of his son, a commemoration which even the ghastly Saddam cynically used to celebrate by releasing prisoners from his jails. "Handed over to the Iraqi authorities," he may have been before his death. But his execution will go down - correctly - as an American affair and time will add its false but lasting gloss to all this - that the West destroyed an Arab leader who no longer obeyed his orders from Washington, that, for all his wrongdoing (and this will be the terrible get-out for Arab historians, this shaving away of his crimes) Saddam died a "martyr" to the will of the new "Crusaders".

When he was captured in November of 2003, the insurgency against American troops increased in ferocity. After his death, it will redouble in intensity again. Freed from the remotest possibility of Saddam's return by his execution, the West's enemies in Iraq have no reason to fear the return of his Baathist regime. Osama bin Laden will certainly rejoice, along with Bush and Blair. And there's a thought. So many crimes avenged.

But we will have got away with it.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fisk/article2112555.ece

Originally posted by eyebuzz:

Lee said there was space for political debate in Singapore, but stressed that discussions on politics must be taken seriously.

So explain the hip-hop monke...errr...I mean Post-65er MPs

Light Cruiser KUMA spent a lot of time in this area in 1943 till her sinking off Penang in Jan 1944. Heavy Cruisers HAGURO and ASHIGARA were assigned to the Tenth Area Fleet in Feb 1945 and also spent quite a lot of time around Singapore. All 3 were sunk by British naval forces, HAGURO to RN destroyers and the other 2 to submarines.

In addition heavy cruisers MYOKO and TAKAO were left stranded in Singapore after being damaged in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. Both unable to be repaired here (lack of materials/facilities) and impossible to tow back (too dangerous) and spent the rest of the war here as floating AA platforms. The British scuttled them in the Malacca Strait after the war.

Most major surface units of the IJN would have stopped by Singapore at one time or the other. The Mobile Fleet's carriers were here before the Battle of the Phillippine Sea.

Japanese cruiser Tabular Record of Movement (click on the ship names I've mentioned)

A Tale of Two Cripples: USS BERGALL vs MYOKO

Can't see Moonstriker's pics too leh...

Here's a pic of the USNS Invincible, sister to the Observation Island, taken in Dec last year at Changi Beach. It's a US Military Sealift Command Missile Range Instrumentation Ship.

Originally posted by ditzy:

How big could a plane possibly be?!?!? I mean c'mon its only a plane for crying out loud!

pls dun flame me

Bigger than what we usually see, that's for sure. Other than the An-124s that come to Changi and PLA once in a while.

Meia, the C-141s used to be regular visitors too, but I believe they've all been retired. Now mostly KC-10s and C-17s that drop by in Singapore, almost daily.

A little bird told me that a C-5 took off from PLA today, about 1730 hours, must be the same one. It must have been a sight to behold! Bigger than the usual C-17s or KC-10s I'm used to seeing here

BTW Oberst, you should start a "Help Obersturmfuhrer buy a better camera so he can take hi-res pics fund" so you can contribute higher-res pics of the fantastic stuff you put on here. $750-900 should get you a nice 2nd hand Canon DSLR with 75-300mm lens or a new Canon S3 with a 432mm zoom...

Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:

The thing is I want to do a Super Puma, but there are no kits around that actually have it. Was thinking of kitbashing and scratchbuilding it and stuff. Any suggestions on good kits to make a somewhat realistic Puma from?

Any ideas on great hobby shops around in SG? Not just those in town I guess, we all know about them.

Check the earlier pages on this thread, answers found there

Originally posted by dork3d:

Hmmm... Me had ran through the RSAF F16 serials already... There's two serials previously belonged to the two F16Cs that were lost in 2002 and 2004 now on the 2nd last order... Can anyone confirm that if these two were the replacements?

Errr...meaning?

Originally posted by dork3d:

If me's not worng about it, me saw it in Jane's that one F16C that was lost in 2002 during a training stint was replaced by USAF with a variant of F16D Blk 52... And the loss in 2004 was already procured and replaced in the last order option when RSAF purchased the last F16D Blk 52 in 2004 just after two months of the mishap...

USAF Block 52 F-16Ds do not have the spine. And serials do not indicate any aircraft has transferred. I reckon both lost aircraft were not replaced.

Those Hornets at PLA are not from Kitty Hawk. They're from VFA-97 Warhawks, a USN unit attached to Marine Air Group 12 in Japan, here for a Commando Sling.

Agree totally with pirate. If it was one of our guys, please remember that CJ and the US Embassy/USN folks are bending over backwards to arrange such visits for us, despite the restrictions due to security concerns. As such, they have rules to play by, and its our responsibility to do the same. They (along with the RSN) have already been kind enough to allow us to go on board, with our cameras to boot. Please do not do anything to jeopardize the visits and the leeway given to us during such visits.

I'm sure we do not want future situations when even camera phones have to be left at the guardhouse, or a total ban on visits altogether.

Originally posted by tripwire:

i wont even bother to scroll up... but i remember well.. that my first post on this thread was not directed against you...

Sure thats true, but I gave an opinion, you responded with a personal insult

Originally posted by tripwire:

can we stop this stupid nut fruit competition... lets at least show some civility before we both ends up looking like hizbollah..

The one who started the war asking for peace? Scroll up to see who fired the first insult between us

Originally posted by tripwire:

oh.. since you so smart... why dont you show us the light?

why not you tell us.. how would you fight the hizbollah if you are the isrealis, put yourself in their shoe and tell us.

i am sure we are all ears...

yes yes, fight fight bomb bomb kill kill...nothing else in tripwires eyes will do the trick except blind self-serving violence. As I've posted on the other Milnuts:

1) Limited strikes against Hezbollah's military structure to weaken it (with a more limited target list as compared to now)

2) Bolster support for the Lebanese government by persuading the US to support it more vigourously with finances etc to rebuild the economy and allow the government to take over the running of schools, hospitals etc, thereby making the people not so reliant on Hezbollah for this and weakening their grassroots support and eventually sidelining their political/social arm.

3) Arrange for a thrid party acceptable to both sides (Turkey for example?) to train and beef up the Lebanese government forces with a view of disarming the militants or integrating them into a Lebanese National Army

It will be a difficult and long term project, taking at least 5-10 years and probably resulting in violent spasms from Hezbollah as the plans take effect and they resist, but if successfully implemented, is the only viable long term option to stabilise Israel's northern flank and secure the lives of residents of the Galilee.

If Israel is really interested in securing long term peace and security the only solution is diplomatic not military.

Originally posted by tripwire:

same to your naiviety. we cant expect much from a fruit... can we?

Hahaha...well I never stopped you from thinking what you think right?

I always enjoy exchanges with tripwire, when he starts calling you names, you know you're getting to him

Originally posted by tripwire:

dont be a fruit tart. in war, will you sacrifice your own soldiers life, just to appear civilised? what value do you place on your fellowman's live?

if your enemy is not gonna respect the rules of engagement... with-holding and restricting your own forces options, would only emboldened the enemy to continue such dastardly practice and put more innocent life on the line, as they seek to explore other similar means.

Typical one track thinking. Its exactly why this world is messed up as it is.

If your enemy does what Hezbollah is doing, it might seem at face value as restricting your options. But thinking smartly, it will also not rise up to the bait and do exactly what he wants you to do, killing innocents in this case and ending up with egg all over your face (blind US politicians aside). If you kill innocents, kena condemn for it and makes you appear callous, you think it'll stop them from doing it again?

Think man think! Or are you incapable of thinking beyond one dimension, or any higher level thinking?

Originally posted by tripwire:

dont push it... we all have a choice on how we choose to respond to a question... not like everyone must march to your tune.

Sure, if you want to act petulant, its your perogative!

I never said you can't...

Originally posted by killstyle:

hi viper u think 2 jews life = hundreds of lebenon lifes acceptable?

hmm... you got a dog head attach to your body?

Hey killstyle, read my posts carefully before you start insulting ok?

Originally posted by beavan:

how do u know that's a f-18hornet?

The burner cans and other details are easily recognisable, if you looked at planes often enough

Originally posted by tripwire:

since you are so morally correct... would you do us the honor of telling the hizbollahs to stop using innocent people and neutral third party as shield for their endless rocketing on isreali civilians.

it would be morally wrong for you not to intervene... and go to lebanon.. and persuade the hizbollah.

Typical petulant answer from tripwire when he's unable to debate on points.

Originally posted by Moonstriker:

CNB able to accomodate the Nimitz if i'm not mistaken..

CNB can accomodate any USN carrier currently in service.

Originally posted by the Bear:

hmm.. are we talking EVERYTHING here?

i would say that the Israelis keep quiet when it serves them.. and the reason they keep quiet about some things, are really sad...

and notice your reaction when i said they "keep quiet"

that is the reason why they would

Well, you did say "the Israelis have been taking the flak for everything"

Originally posted by the Bear:

oh well.. whatever the hell we say, isn't going to change anything unless states stop supporting the lunacy which is happening there...

and you see that happening?

Yes, totally agree with you when you say states stop conducting and supporting this lunacy, and that includes the Americans and their support of Israel while pretending to be an honest broker for peace

Originally posted by the Bear:

and try to stay alive in a region where the obsession of every country around them is the destruction of Israel...

Touching, but exaggerated and totally untrue. The only ones who are avowed to that are Iran, Hezbollah, Hamas and a few fringe groups who have no chance in hell of being able to do that (except maybe for a nuclear Iran which hasn't happened yet). Lebanon, Egypt, Syria and Jordan (which are THE countries around Israel) have renounced that and acknolwledged Israel's right to exist, as has Fatah and all the other Arab countries(Iran is Persian).

2 questions Bear:

- Were there rockets being fired from near the UN post *at the time*? No one knows, but judging from they way the area was being shelled for the past few hours before the bomb hits, I say unlikely

- Even if there was, how far were they launch positions from the UN post? Was it reasonable to expect that the distance between the UN post and the launch position was so close that a laser-guided bomb will score a direct hit on the post when it missed the target? Again, I'd say unlikely

As for Israel keeping quiet, I'm sorry but what planet have you been on? Look at how the Lobby influences the media, such that even some Americans are complaining that the Israeli press is more critical of Israel than the American press. Go watch the Google video link posted earlier, and come tell us again if Israel suffers in silence when "wrongly accused".

And yes, as a soldier, you remain at your post till you're told otherwise. Anything else is cowardice, like the German policemen who used "democracy" as a (bad) excuse for cowardice inside the Boeing 727 during the bungled rescue of the Israeli athletes during the Munich Olympics massacre.

The day states stoop to the level of terrorists and criminals, supposedly to fight them, humankind is in trouble.