They Say, We Say: Evidence of the Obvious
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Originally posted by BadzMaro:
First of all, God’s origin or location are outside our capacity for knowledge & comprehension. Similarly our understanding of eternity can only be grasped in metaphors, whether a banquet on the one hand or a smouldering rubbish dump on the other.
Secondly, you hinge so much on the texts. Now I am not a theologian nor a philosopher. Are you ? Have you spent years, decades or centuries on it ?
Besides that fact, enlighten me. Are you saying that all theories are infallible ?
How different are you from us in including your own fundamental assumptions about the universe, is it not also a blind leap of faith, unsupported by evidence?
If everyone needs to be a specialist in thier field to comment on a subject matter, what qualifications then do you have to comment on this subject matter ?
I posing these questions because I do not expect an answer from you. They are open questions for you to consider. IF you are certain, even more certain than the scientists, great thinkers, theologians and the likes. Feel free to. And I really dont expect a 500 word thread on it.
Hi BadMaroz
1. You have agreed with me that it is not possible to detect or know where the God(s) are because right now. Let me bring you further why we can't know where they are or how they come about - Because there isn't any empirical evidence to support the existence of these entities. Because no one has seen/talked/touched/heard the Gods literally.
2. You used the word "eternity" like it's a proven fact. It's not. What is eternity? Is it a fact or just a concept?
3. Yes I have studied (though not MANY years) hindu, taoist, christian and buddhist texts. NOT ALL OF IT, but parts of these religious texts. But I have studied the christian and muslim texts extensively and have concluded (like many others) that these Gods are most likely not possible.
4. I don't take leaps of faith to believe in things or entities that don't have a shred of evidence. I believe in facts and evidence. That's all.
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when can't prove or asked to prove, explain things like its beyond human comprehension, god works in mysterious ways, how can a human being understand divinity, when the human is just mere mortal.
anyway we know that god exists in bible, the way superman exists in movies and DC comics.
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I agree with Rooney
You cant just use "god works in mysterious ways" or "god is beyond us" to explain the questions.
They are really not valid explanations.
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Originally posted by Rooney_07:
when can't prove or asked to prove, explain things like its beyond human comprehension, god works in mysterious ways, how can a human being understand divinity, when the human is just mere mortal.
anyway we know that god exists in bible, the way superman exists in movies and DC comics.
your first para , I agree. Was so disappointed when I asked questions and never get any reply but those you stated were given to me. Crap! That is why when Buddhists are able to answer all that I asked for I was so surprised.your second para is hilarious! I don't care, even if he does exist He is not doing to all that the bible states. Like a salesman who cannot deliver what he promises, this is bad!
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Originally posted by winsomeea:
your first para , I agree. Was so disappointed when I asked questions and never get any reply but those you stated were given to me. Crap! That is why when Buddhists are able to answer all that I asked for I was so surprised.your second para is hilarious! I don't care, even if he does exist He is not doing to all that the bible states. Like a salesman who cannot deliver what he promises, this is bad!
he is not doing a good job not that he exists. I can do a better job than him lol.
anyway god is not in human form, so we cannot call him, him. since god is a spirit, we should call, it.
if I am a god, I will straight away make everyone in this cosmos including me disappear, de-exist, cos if you do not exists, you do not suffer isnt it. if you do not exists, there is no problem.
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Originally posted by Tcmc:
Hi BadMaroz
1. You have agreed with me that it is not possible to detect or know where the God(s) are because right now. Let me bring you further why we can't know where they are or how they come about - Because there isn't any empirical evidence to support the existence of these entities. Because no one has seen/talked/touched/heard the Gods literally.
2. You used the word "eternity" like it's a proven fact. It's not. What is eternity? Is it a fact or just a concept?
3. Yes I have studied (though not MANY years) hindu, taoist, christian and buddhist texts. NOT ALL OF IT, but parts of these religious texts. But I have studied the christian and muslim texts extensively and have concluded (like many others) that these Gods are most likely not possible.
4. I don't take leaps of faith to believe in things or entities that don't have a shred of evidence. I believe in facts and evidence. That's all.
BadMaroz
So everytime we question you seomthing about your religion that doesn't "make sense", you would just say "god is beyond our comprehension" or "god works in mysterious ways".
Therefore now I am telling you try to authenticate the miracles in the bible practically. To prove that the miralces did happen and were real. Some christians have tried to convince me bfore and they did a good job.
How about you? Thanks.:)
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Originally posted by Tcmc:
Hi BadMaroz
1. You have agreed with me that it is not possible to detect or know where the God(s) are because right now. Let me bring you further why we can't know where they are or how they come about - Because there isn't any empirical evidence to support the existence of these entities. Because no one has seen/talked/touched/heard the Gods literally.
2. You used the word "eternity" like it's a proven fact. It's not. What is eternity? Is it a fact or just a concept?
3. Yes I have studied (though not MANY years) hindu, taoist, christian and buddhist texts. NOT ALL OF IT, but parts of these religious texts. But I have studied the christian and muslim texts extensively and have concluded (like many others) that these Gods are most likely not possible.
4. I don't take leaps of faith to believe in things or entities that don't have a shred of evidence. I believe in facts and evidence. That's all.
First of all, since when can concept cannot be fact ? So what is eternity ? Does it matter if I know what eternity is to me if you don't believe in eternity ?
Secondly, you claim to have studied hindu, taost, christian and buddhist text. So tell me. What is the message you have gathered from all these sacred texts? I sure as hell do not see an enlightened mind here. What happened to the supposedly learned traits of such a person ? I dont see it. Do you ?
Thirdly, so you believe in facts and evidence. Fair enough. If you are the kind that can only believe in the tangible, then you should not believe that Love exists then right ? Where is the factual basis of such a 'concept' then ? mmmmmm ?
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Originally posted by Tcmc:
BadMaroz
So everytime we question you seomthing about your religion that doesn't "make sense", you would just say "god is beyond our comprehension" or "god works in mysterious ways".
Therefore now I am telling you try to authenticate the miracles in the bible practically. To prove that the miralces did happen and were real. Some christians have tried to convince me bfore and they did a good job.
How about you? Thanks.:)
Did I ever say that 'God works in mysterious ways ?' Show me a post that I actually said that. Show it. Where ? I am gathering your posts and I am slowly seeing a picture here. And its not very flattering to yourself eventhough U want to appear to be non-condencending.
So you want me to authenticate a Miracle. Is that it ? Does it matter if I authenticate somehting to someone who does not believe in miracles ? You have already claimed in your previous post that you can only blieve factual tangible things.
So you must think that a miracle is nothing more than a natural law not discovered.At the very least yes ? So, you don't believe in miracles. You think everything can be explained scientifically. I don’t see how raising someone from the dead, restoring a blind man’s sight, etc. are natural laws not yet discovered.
Now I am not a theologian. I stress that again. Mircales according to the Christian faith to my current understanding is that it follows the usual steps of observation, interpretation and application, but since the miracles are stories, we will need to look at things like plot, character development, etc. to understand them fully.
We need to study the events of the miracle (observation), determine what truths it teaches (interpretation) and then determine how the truths apply to us (application).
Some Christians have dont a good job convincing you. So why are u here ? Does it look like an enlightened mind here trying to seek answers? Or are you just someone who just got beef with people of faith, especially Christianity and is pretty much an intolerant discriminatory person.
But really, does it matter ? You don't believe. But what are u doing here ? For someone who does not believe in some divine entity seems to be spending alot of time in here. Why ?You can say you are here to seek answers but are you really ? Really ?REALLY ?
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Originally posted by Tcmc:
BadMaroz
So everytime we question you seomthing about your religion that doesn't "make sense", you would just say "god is beyond our comprehension" or "god works in mysterious ways".
Therefore now I am telling you try to authenticate the miracles in the bible practically. To prove that the miralces did happen and were real. Some christians have tried to convince me bfore and they did a good job.
How about you? Thanks.:)
You are beyond our comprehension.
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Rooney, you claimed to be able to do a better job than God. How so?
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Originally posted by BadzMaro:
First of all, since when can concept cannot be fact ? So what is eternity ? Does it matter if I know what eternity is to me if you don't believe in eternity ?
Secondly, you claim to have studied hindu, taost, christian and buddhist text. So tell me. What is the message you have gathered from all these sacred texts? I sure as hell do not see an enlightened mind here. What happened to the supposedly learned traits of such a person ? I dont see it. Do you ?
Thirdly, so you believe in facts and evidence. Fair enough. If you are the kind that can only believe in the tangible, then you should not believe that Love exists then right ? Where is the factual basis of such a 'concept' then ? mmmmmm ?
love is more real than god
, which was invented by mankind, not vice versa, like the way superman was created by DC Comics. -
We know who Superman's creators were. Since you said God is created by man, who? Or is that you say one? Yes love is real but you can't see it or touch it with your senses. Love cannot be tested by scientists. The Bible teaches that God is love. And God is Spirit so He cannot be tested by empirical means. Nevertheless He is just as real as love.
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Originally posted by BroInChrist:
We know who Superman’s creators were. Since you said God is created by man, who? Or is that you say one? Yes love is real but you can’t see it or touch it with your senses. Love cannot be tested by scientists. The Bible teaches that God is love. And God is Spirit so He cannot be tested by empirical means. Nevertheless He is just as real as love.
of course you would say god is real as a christian, but I beg to differ so cos I am not a christian
yes christians are convinced of god existence, but to non believers, god is as real as superman
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Christians are convinced of God's existence because there are good reasons for doing so. Even noted atheist Anthony Flew finally was convinced. What good reasons do you have for being an atheist?
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your argument doesnt stand you in good stead really. does he represent for all non believers? do you want to take into account of the many xtians who left, cos they dun believe it any more., what about that?
as for me, I can see clearly as day and night, too many inconsistencies and paradoxes in the belief system and I am not well verse in the bible. goodness me if I am well verse and I can even spot more of the inconsistencies and paradoxes even more. anyway I know the origination of religions, how and why it got started, than you who are hopelessly ignorant and still think you know it more?
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Originally posted by BroInChrist:
Christians are convinced of God’s existence because there are good reasons for doing so. Even noted atheist Anthony Flew finally was convinced. What good reasons do you have for being an atheist?
of course God is real.................just like Jesus...................and Darth Vader.................
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. . . Fromthestarterofthisthread.
. . . IF YOU BELIEVE GOD IS NOT REAL ITS UP TO YOU. BUT FOR ME I CAN PROVE IT AND BELIEVE THAT HE IS REAL. WHY? BECAUSE HE CHANGE MY LIFE AND MAKE ME REALIZE WHO REALLY I AM.
. . . HOW I PRAY, YOU MY BRO. OR SIS. WILL EXPERIENCE WHAT I AM EXPERIENCING TODAY.
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Atheists like to scoff and mock at the Christian by saying that God is like Santa Claus or Darth Vader. But such a claim establishes or proves nothing at all. I can just as easily rebutt by saying that God is as real as the tree i see before me. If atheists wish to be taken seriously then they really need to put in some real hard work in arguing their position. Perhaps it is no wonder that atheists are constantly losing the public debates with theists.
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Originally posted by BroInChrist:
Atheists like to scoff and mock at the Christian by saying that God is like Santa Claus or Darth Vader. But such a claim establishes or proves nothing at all. I can just as easily rebutt by saying that God is as real as the tree i see before me. If atheists wish to be taken seriously then they really need to put in some real hard work in arguing their position. Perhaps it is no wonder that atheists are constantly losing the public debates with theists.
I have to give it to you on your warped reasoning, shakes head
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Originally posted by Susanteo2011:
of course God is real.................just like Jesus...................and Darth Vader.................
yes thats right, god is real in the bible, just like spiderman was in the movies and comic books
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Ad hominem attack Rooney? Please explain why my reasoning is warped. Show the fallacies I committed if you can.
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Originally posted by BroInChrist:
Ad hominem attack Rooney? Please explain why my reasoning is warped. Show the fallacies I committed if you can.
Its not ad hominemIts really warped
You made those statements, you prove it
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Threads like these...
Are threads like chicken and egg..
We can argue till the cows come home and there will be no conclusion..
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Of course
Thats why i always say EH is a very useless forum
Taking up memory space
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Hahahha.
Cannot. Must continue to.. Give some (delusional) people hope...