Originally posted by Wheref:Heh was it because of all our foreigner friends that made it super tough to get in the list? Heard that they learnt some of those stuff back in their China schools already..Anyway what's the top percentage to get into the list?
Btw, is the engineering course in NUS only meant for the first year? Like maybe you are expected to branch into another more specialised course in the second year like Electrical Engineering, Chemical, etc.?
Hi Wheref,
To get into the Dean list, one must be within the top 5% of his/her cohort for that particular semester. Depending on the faculty, there are other requirements as well, which usually includes a certain minimum Semester Average Point and a minimum amount of modules to be done in that particular semester.
Cheers.
Originally posted by limywv:you are a guy who's just angry...about something you feel is unfair
unfair regarding ?
jc is ultimately better then poly ?
Originally posted by dkcx:Just some minor disagreements with many of the arguements but too many things to quote.
Eagle, our 'generation' belongs more to the age where everyone who can go to JC will go to JC while its the poorer students that choose to go to poly. You graduated before me and even during my batch, poly was still considered a place that only ppl who cannot go JC choose to go. However nowadays, the trends are increasing for top studens who reject JCs and go to poly so its no longer able to use poly/jc grads of our time to compare to now.
There are JC students that get the FCH i won't deny esp at your time last year however are u certain that all the bottom students are poly students or are there still a large number of JC students at the bottom as well? Rather than paint a very positive picture and only talking about the top, we should consider the whole picture and see the whole cohort for discussion. Furthermore, how many peoeple can really dream about getting that FCH?
For salary comarisions, its unfair to compare poly with uni because they are of different standard. If a poly student can ever earn more than a uni grad, there is no reason to go uni already. If you compare JC to poly, a poly can earn 1-2k salary, a JC student pathetic amount.
Furthermore, alot of poly students choose to go overseas to study as do many JC students. Overseas, poly students can get 1.5-2yrs exemption for almost any course which makes a poly grad graduate even earlier than a JC grad who goes to the same overseas uni. In fact for my poly course, about half or so of the top scorers all chose to go overseas uni to study rather than local uni so its not fair to just judge those who go from poly to local uni as really the best from poly.
Ahh... that's quite insightful on the part where they prefer to go to overseas uni.
Let me just add on that previous 'top' schools with 'top' students are all in the IP stream, so many would go on to complete JC. I'm not sure about engineering, but I know it's very tough to get into Mass Comm course in Poly.
There are JC students that get the FCH i won't deny esp at your time last year however are u certain that all the bottom students are poly students or are there still a large number of JC students at the bottom as well? Rather than paint a very positive picture and only talking about the top, we should consider the whole picture and see the whole cohort for discussion. Furthermore, how many peoeple can really dream about getting that FCH?
Nice one as well. But if we were to compare top scorers from poly vs top scorers from JC entering into Uni? What's the percentage of FCH from top scorers coming from poly and JC?
My main take is that poly grads face a steeper slope to scoring better in uni based on mathematical calculations and probability. It's not about which course is better or not ;) Pure hard work will still ensure a good score.
Regarding the salary part, I'm just stating the current mkt conditions, wasn't comparing ;)
Of course, A level grads would earn much much less.
Originally posted by Wheref:Heh was it because of all our foreigner friends that made it super tough to get in the list? Heard that they learnt some of those stuff back in their China schools already..Anyway what's the top percentage to get into the list?
Btw, is the engineering course in NUS only meant for the first year? Like maybe you are expected to branch into another more specialised course in the second year like Electrical Engineering, Chemical, etc.?
yep they did learn most back in China. But for my batch, quite a number who got Dean's List are locals like me... So
Requirements are at least 4.5 in semester average plus within top 5% of cohort. Usually, the top 5% semester average is about 4.8.
For engineering in NUS, you can now branch into specialised discipline immediately in the first year. This started in year 2004.
Originally posted by eagle:Nice one as well. But if we were to compare top scorers from poly vs top scorers from JC entering into Uni? What's the percentage of FCH from top scorers coming from poly and JC?
Actually i feel alot is still base on their initial academic ability. There are still more 6 pointers in JC than poly and these people are expected to still maintain their 'lead'. The number of people who catch up are there but are rarely in signficant enough numbers to kick all the top scorers off FCH.
However i won't deny that JC students have an edge in the theoretical aspect while poly students have an edge in the practical aspect. What i feel is if the person intends to continue on doing research etc, a theoretical background would be beneficial but for field related work, i feel the poly hands on experience would be a large edge over JC students cos poly has more hands on than uni from what i experience.
It's true that hands on experience, poly would have a larger edge.
However, it depends on the industry you would work in. For example, for my job scope, I do test programs, implement test methodologies, giving presentations on theoretical aspects and reasons why certain things were done, as well as coordinate between product engineers and test floors. Hands on engineering is useless here ;)
if you're VJ material, you shouldnt even be thinking about poly. The jc/poly debate applies only to the middle or low range student who actually has to decide between a mediocre JC and the poly alternative. Once you get into a top JC, your path is set (unless you're a lazy prick) and entry into a good uni is a virtual guarantee
Is the degree in Engineering just all about physics and maths? Does it make use of chem?
Hmm.. Then what if you decided not to specialise and decided to continue in your degree in engineering, does that mean that you're sort of learning bits and bits of other specialised courses? Sort of like jack of all trade, master of none?
Oh also, if you were to specialise in the second year, would you lose out to those who are already in that course for a year?
Hehe another point to add on, sorry for the troubles :x I've read that engineering grads are able to take on jobs in the banking and finance sector. How true is that and how so? Is it because that they have read mathematics in their course thus employers are willing to hire them?
Thanks for the replies guys, need some enlightenment on what courses I should take after my A's. :)
Originally posted by eagle:It's true that hands on experience, poly would have a larger edge.
However, it depends on the industry you would work in. For example, for my job scope, I do test programs, implement test methodologies, giving presentations on theoretical aspects and reasons why certain things were done, as well as coordinate between product engineers and test floors. Hands on engineering is useless here ;)
I would say that really depends on the job you apply for i guess. For my line, a chemist is more on hands on and analysis skills and much less theory required unless we are trying to do some research or something happens which disrupt the usual results that requires investigation.
Originally posted by Wheref:Is the degree in Engineering just all about physics and maths? Does it make use of chem?
Hmm.. Then what if you decided not to specialise and decided to continue in your degree in engineering, does that mean that you're sort of learning bits and bits of other specialised courses? Sort of like jack of all trade, master of none?
Oh also, if you were to specialise in the second year, would you lose out to those who are already in that course for a year?
Hehe another point to add on, sorry for the troubles :x I've read that engineering grads are able to take on jobs in the banking and finance sector. How true is that and how so? Is it because that they have read mathematics in their course thus employers are willing to hire them?
Thanks for the replies guys, need some enlightenment on what courses I should take after my A's. :)
Not sure about NUS but NTU's engineering grads most of them will have to go through a basic chemistry module but only chemical engineers and material engineers will do abit more chemistry.
There is no general engineering course in NTU and i really doubt NUS would have it since a general engineering degree seems quite useless compared to all the specialised degrees.
Many engineering grads get work in the banking and finance industry for their anlytical skills etc. Its quite common i would say and i've known at least 1 or 2 engineer grads who works in the banking and finance industry.
What course you should take i would feel should depend more on ur interest and abit less on its future prospect since the market is ever changing. I feel that a course you have no interest in is a torture to study through regardless how much it might pay in future.
There's no general engineering course in NTU or NUS? Crap lol, then how come the Cut-Off-Points that they released have?
Originally posted by Wheref:There's no general engineering course in NTU or NUS? Crap lol, then how come the Cut-Off-Points that they released have?
There is a common engine phase which is the 1st yr for electrical, mechanical, civl and environmental engineering for NTU. Those students that do not choose which engineering to specialist in will choose their specialisation in their 2nd yr subjected to the number of available places.
NUS i do not know.
Originally posted by dkcx:There is a common engine phase which is the 1st yr for electrical, mechanical, civl and environmental engineering for NTU. Those students that do not choose which engineering to specialist in will choose their specialisation in their 2nd yr subjected to the number of available places.
NUS i do not know.
Haha whew that's good to hear then, thanks :D
So in the end all the engineering students will have to specialise right?
Dont worry. I was in the lousiest express class in my secondary school 6-8 years back too. My subject combi is like this:
(1) English
Language
(2) Mother Tongue
(3) Elementary
Mathematics
(4) Combined Science (Phy / Chem)
(5) Principles of Accounts
(6) Art
(7) Social Studies + History
Take note, there is not A math or pure sciences. In the beginning I was like you, scared that my basics are so bad that I can't catch up in JC and worry if I could get a place in uni. And I studied hard and played hard (hugely involved in a sports CCA) too. I didn't really study that hard, just consistent doing of tutorials and homeworks and pay attention during lectures. No extra work done. I still got into a science class in JC (H2 phy, chem and math) and with the same amount of effort, I scored 3 As, enough for me to secure a place in a reputable course in NTU.
The bottomline is, it can be done. Your effort matters the most. (:
All the best!
Go JC for what? Go JC does not guarantee you direct entry into University leh.. If you did badly for your A levels, you will still not be able to enter University and then you are stuck with A level certs.
I have seen friends that went to JC, then did badly, and then end up retaking A levels, and then still not make it into University, then Lan Lan come out go apply for poly. This is because A level cert gets you no where. Whereas with a poly cert at least you are recognised and able to get a job of >$1800. With an A level cert, you probably get pay like $1600 only.
I have a polytechnic friend, she is now getting $2300, which is what some graduates get as well.
Dont keep thinking about JC, the only good thing about JC is their cheap bus rides and hot girls in uniforms, and you get to sing the national anthem and say the pledge, thats all!!!
I was able to get into JC last time, and I wanted to go through JC route as well, but then I ended up going for poly. I can tell you poly times is the best in my life!! Study hard and you would end up with a diploma with merit. Its really easy getting a diploma with merit, you just need to work harder and be the top 5%.
Gaining a diploma with merit is a plus point because it allows you to enter local university much easier. Like if you get diploma with merit in business, then you enter nus business easier, in fact, you dont have to worry much, cuase they will accept you.
For my case, i got merit, therefore when i apply for my course in NUS, i did not need to worry about not getting in, because i know i will get in.
Furthermore, going through poly routes gives you advantage in Uni as well, because what they teaches in university, some of the easier concepts were taught in poly. Also, you get exempted from some of those boring electives (up to 5 modules). If you are damn Zai, you can go for advanced placement tests, and if you pass all of them, then you will be able to skip all the year 1 modules, therefore you got straight to second year modules. The above mention is for NUS only. But I personally think this is only good for girls, because guys after the 2 years in army, would probably forget everything thing that he was taught before. For NTU, if you get diploma with merit, you go DIRECTLY to second year. And also if you are normal diploma holder, you will have a higher chance to get into NTU as well. Please note, I am only refering to science courses.
Lastly, for getting into Dean's list in NUS, you need to be the top 5%, and your Semester Average point must be damn high, at least all A. You must have at least 4.8 - 4.9 out of a possible 5 to be eligible for Deans list. You must also take at least 5 modules a sem. If you take 4 modules and you get all A+ (SAP of 5 points), you will still not be consider Dean's list.
Its good that you think about your future. Work hard and your future will be bright.
Originally posted by Wheref:Haha whew that's good to hear then, thanks :D
So in the end all the engineering students will have to specialise right?
I believe yes
dkcx... I think I pm u why for me, JC route is much better... Perhaps it would be different for different people, but for me, JC route was way much better... both in the financial and education sense... There are certain things and opportunities that are opened to top students in JCs vs top students in poly...
Some of the information would be slightly more private, that's why will not be typing here.
Originally posted by MaNyZeR:Go JC for what? Go JC does not guarantee you direct entry into University leh.. If you did badly for your A levels, you will still not be able to enter University and then you are stuck with A level certs.
I have seen friends that went to JC, then did badly, and then end up retaking A levels, and then still not make it into University, then Lan Lan come out go apply for poly. This is because A level cert gets you no where. Whereas with a poly cert at least you are recognised and able to get a job of >$1800. With an A level cert, you probably get pay like $1600 only.
I have a polytechnic friend, she is now getting $2300, which is what some graduates get as well.
Dont keep thinking about JC, the only good thing about JC is their cheap bus rides and hot girls in uniforms, and you get to sing the national anthem and say the pledge, thats all!!!
I was able to get into JC last time, and I wanted to go through JC route as well, but then I ended up going for poly. I can tell you poly times is the best in my life!! Study hard and you would end up with a diploma with merit. Its really easy getting a diploma with merit, you just need to work harder and be the top 5%.
Gaining a diploma with merit is a plus point because it allows you to enter local university much easier. Like if you get diploma with merit in business, then you enter nus business easier, in fact, you dont have to worry much, cuase they will accept you.
For my case, i got merit, therefore when i apply for my course in NUS, i did not need to worry about not getting in, because i know i will get in.
Furthermore, going through poly routes gives you advantage in Uni as well, because what they teaches in university, some of the easier concepts were taught in poly. Also, you get exempted from some of those boring electives (up to 5 modules). If you are damn Zai, you can go for advanced placement tests, and if you pass all of them, then you will be able to skip all the year 1 modules, therefore you got straight to second year modules. The above mention is for NUS only. But I personally think this is only good for girls, because guys after the 2 years in army, would probably forget everything thing that he was taught before. For NTU, if you get diploma with merit, you go DIRECTLY to second year. And also if you are normal diploma holder, you will have a higher chance to get into NTU as well. Please note, I am only refering to science courses.
Lastly, for getting into Dean's list in NUS, you need to be the top 5%, and your Semester Average point must be damn high, at least all A. You must have at least 4.8 - 4.9 out of a possible 5 to be eligible for Deans list. You must also take at least 5 modules a sem. If you take 4 modules and you get all A+ (SAP of 5 points), you will still not be consider Dean's list.
Its good that you think about your future. Work hard and your future will be bright.
Furthermore, going through poly routes gives you advantage in Uni as well, because what they teaches in university, some of the easier concepts were taught in poly. Also, you get exempted from some of those boring electives (up to 5 modules). If you are damn Zai, you can go for advanced placement tests, and if you pass all of them, then you will be able to skip all the year 1 modules, therefore you got straight to second year modules. The above mention is for NUS only. But I personally think this is only good for girls, because guys after the 2 years in army, would probably forget everything thing that he was taught before. For NTU, if you get diploma with merit, you go DIRECTLY to second year. And also if you are normal diploma holder, you will have a higher chance to get into NTU as well. Please note, I am only refering to science courses.
Precisely... I mentioned this earlier :)
Also, the other disadvantage is that poly students would lose the chance to build a formidable base of As for a good CAP with the easier modules in the first year as compared to JC students. i.e. For the modules you skipped for the first year, I would have a strong base of As. So in the second, third and fourth years, I would have a bigger buffer.
Next is the time. Not all the first year modules can be skipped. So in that sense, you need to 'overload' a little in 3 years. However, I would overload myself in the first year where the modules are much simpler, and in the final years, I would be taking less modules and be better able to concentrate on the FYP.
Originally posted by eagle:Precisely... I mentioned this earlier :)
Also, the other disadvantage is that poly students would lose the chance to build a formidable base of As for a good CAP with the easier modules in the first year as compared to JC students. i.e. For the modules you skipped for the first year, I would have a strong base of As. So in the second, third and fourth years, I would have a bigger buffer.
Next is the time. Not all the first year modules can be skipped. So in that sense, you need to 'overload' a little in 3 years. However, I would overload myself in the first year where the modules are much simpler, and in the final years, I would be taking less modules and be better able to concentrate on the FYP.
Actually exemptions is not complusory something you must accept. I for one did not take some of the exemptions i was offered and i did better than many of my JC peers including the girls to get an A. Choosing to take exemptions or not is up to the individual
Originally posted by eagle:dkcx... I think I pm u why for me, JC route is much better... Perhaps it would be different for different people, but for me, JC route was way much better... both in the financial and education sense... There are certain things and opportunities that are opened to top students in JCs vs top students in poly...
Some of the information would be slightly more private, that's why will not be typing here.
I won't deny there is a difference.
Personally when i made the choice to go to poly, it surprised quite a few people around me especially since my sch is 1 where u normally get the impression that all will go JC during those days but i below to the minority that goes against the norm.
However i can be confident enough to say that if i were to go JC, i would not be able to get my place in uni becos JC way to study is totally not for me. I didn't do superb for my O's but i did alot better in poly getting into the honours roll for 2 out of 6 sems which is something like poly's equivalent of the dean's list.
i still believe poly is better than jc.
n harm giving it a try for greater benefits
Originally posted by dkcx:Actually exemptions is not complusory something you must accept. I for one did not take some of the exemptions i was offered and i did better than many of my JC peers including the girls to get an A. Choosing to take exemptions or not is up to the individual
Yup, if u do not take the exemptions, it would be better in building that base :)
But that means you might have to take more modules or spend an extra sem as compared to most...
Originally posted by eagle:Yup, if u do not take the exemptions, it would be better in building that base :)
But that means you might have to take more modules or spend an extra sem as compared to most...
At the very most, its just going through the same course with the JC students would be and in that way, actually a number of poly students have the edge over JC students cos its almost an entire revision for poly students while JC students might have abit of new content to learn especially their practical skills which are a breeze for poly students. Its a year wasted to some but there are some people who don't mind spending 1 more yr to get a 1st class or 2nd upper honours.
The 2 yrs in NS definitely made my theoretical knowledge quite weak but my practical knowledge were all intact and returning to lab in uni was a piece of cake for me as well as most of my poly friends.
Not to belittle the JC students but for chemistry lab, all the JC students are as good as having a big neon light above their heads saying i am from JC because its obvious they have no idea what they are doing nor how to start anything while to the poly students its juz a repeat of what we are so used to.
Even now in year 3, i still have a quicker understanding of experimentatal results pattern compared to my JC mates so i'm always the 1 who will look at the results and tell them whether we need redo the experiment since the results are not good without really needing to go through all the calculations to actually get the actual results.
i used to be in e last class of express..
still got into JC and finished Uni..and during Uni times i got to see alot of my primary sch mates who went to prestigious schools...
y let that bother u?
but then again..i was always within top 2 in my class in sec school...